Shots Fired, Ford

"K-Roll-PorscheTamer" (k-roll390) 01/08/2015 at 18:19 • Filed to: Fuel Economy

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And quite honestly, I'm inclined to agree.

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No offense to the Ecoboost engines or Ford, they're nice mills with tons of torque, I like my FoST, and then when you tune them, oh mah lawd! But god damn, is it damn near impossible to get EPA averages with these cars, even driving unethusiastically/without a purpose lightly.

For the sake of science, I tried driving without boosting or in the lower rpms and granny shifting and following the shift light on my FoST with a full tank for two weeks; mostly city and some highway, but the city roads were all very long straights with very little stop-n-go.

EPA estimates are as follows for the FoST:

23/32/26 combined

I averaged 23.2, what the hell is this??

Let me get this straight, I drove like an boring fart for two weeks and couldn't even get closer than that...WOW!

Not only that, almost seems a number of the FoST owners on the forums can attest to poor MPGs as well.

This is part of the reason I'm not very inclined to believe that FI engines are truly the future for the fuel economic world. I mean, I accept it for what it is, but it only seems to serve as a gimmick to play the EPA with fake numbers on paper, and not even come close in the real world.

How do they even do MPG tests, the EPA?

ST owners, or FI engined car owners in general, what's up with this? Anyone wanna weigh in on this subject?

RallyWrench > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:22

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" For the sake of science, I tried driving without boosting or in the lower rpms and granny shifting"

Maybe you weren't double clutching like ya should?

jsemerica > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:23

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Any idea on what your highway mileage is like?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > RallyWrench 01/08/2015 at 18:24

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What would that do? I don't even know how to do that.

Leon711 > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:25

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I had a BMW 120d for a week and met and exceeded the EU cycle figures (something most americans think is optimistic) I got over 56 MPG (US) combined versus a quoted highway 55MPG

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > jsemerica 01/08/2015 at 18:25

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Highway mileage was much better than city of course. I had it on paper a while ago, but I lost it when I cleaned out my dorm. I know for a fact that I never got 32MPG though, I usually am doing 75-80 and I leave cruise control on. Probably mid-high 20s.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Leon711 01/08/2015 at 18:26

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Are Euro MPGs different from US MPGs?

RallyWrench > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:27

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Sorry, it was a Fast & Furious reference. Couldn't help it.

Leon711 > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:27

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an imperial gallon is 4.55 litres a US gallon is 3.5 litres. so I got 68 mpg.

Sir_Stig: and toxic masculinity ruins the party again. > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:28

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Weird, I average 30mpg... What octane rating do you use?

petebmwm > RallyWrench 01/08/2015 at 18:28

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would have done danger to the manifold..

HammerheadFistpunch > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:30

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Engines tuned for the EPA cycle and for outright performance. thats it. FordBoost.

Sir_Stig: and toxic masculinity ruins the party again. > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:30

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Well i'm sure if you went 65 you would meet or exceed it, at least on the FiST the gearing is such that 65 is right on the threshold of boost.

RallyWrench > petebmwm 01/08/2015 at 18:32

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Shut up!

Zipppy, Mazdurp builder, Probeski owner and former ricerboy > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:34

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Meanwhile in a TDI, I drive like an idiot, and I get over 40. Explain this.

Vicente Esteve > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:35

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I think that Eco-Boost is more about churning out the most horsepower from the smallest displacement. Not using the least fuel for the most amount of horsepower.

In my TSI I get a lot closer to the EPA ratings though.

HammerheadFistpunch > Zipppy, Mazdurp builder, Probeski owner and former ricerboy 01/08/2015 at 18:36

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My city mileage this winter has been mid 30's, but driving on the highway...at 80 over hill and dale with a full load....high 40's

CRider > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:37

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Yes, the EU testing cycle is different and EU gallons are larger than US gallons.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Sir_Stig: and toxic masculinity ruins the party again. 01/08/2015 at 18:37

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I was using 93, but seeing as I couldn't even and still can't get close to the EPA numbers, I said fuckit and am now using 87, at least while 87 is under $2.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Vicente Esteve 01/08/2015 at 18:38

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Then they shouldn't call it an "Eco"-BOOST. They should've called it something a little more believable.

Sir_Stig: and toxic masculinity ruins the party again. > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:40

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Weird, I use 91 and I'm getting advertised or better...

RallyWrench > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:41

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Sorry, I shouldn't have hijacked this with F&F jokes, but to your topic: How early are you getting into the upper gears? The EPA mileage likely has the car into at least 5th by no more than 40mph, using large throttle openings to reduce pumping losses, while controlling output with timing & boost control. That's what electronic throttles help most with from an emissions standpoint. You might think you're at 50% throttle, but it's open more than that & is giving you the requested output by other means. Also, winter mileage isn't really a direct comparison, because colder, more dense air requires more fuel to combust. Great for power, bad for economy.

norskracer98-ExploringTheOutback > Vicente Esteve 01/08/2015 at 18:42

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Then maybe they should stop saying the "the most fuel efficient trucks in the class" when they get the same exact mileage as a 6.2 SBC under normal driving conditions. At least the Ram's 3.0L diesel could have an actual claim being as diesels usually get better mileage.

I own dead car brands only > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:43

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in my old Saab, I routinely got 35-36, highest was 38.6.

Turbocharged 2.0 4 cylinder and it was even tuned to make 260 HP from 210 HP.

Epa was 20/32.

norskracer98-ExploringTheOutback > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:43

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Or they could maybe change the EPA things to get them more like actual real life fuel efficiency numbers.

Funktheduck > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:44

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Interesting. I avoided turbo'd cars during my shopping this summer because I was concerned about longevity/costs for longevity. Turbos are expensive.

Just for a bit of bragging I get pretty close to EPA estimates for my car. I actually usually do a little better city. If I drive 65 I do better than EPA highway, but who does that?

Funktheduck > RallyWrench 01/08/2015 at 18:45

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Then the floor would fall off for no reason. The engine would blow. Then drive away fine once the cops show up.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Sir_Stig: and toxic masculinity ruins the party again. 01/08/2015 at 18:45

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Quite honestly, I doubt doing 65-70 would be enough.

itschrome > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:45

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no,no, no eco doesn't mean ecological. Like it's good on gas and thats good for the ecosystem. it means economic! and not as in it's economic to run. it's ecoboost as in You will boost your local economy with all the money you'll spend on gas!

NotUnlessRoundIsFunny > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:46

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I'm enjoying mine, but it's frankly more "Boost" than "Eco."

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > RallyWrench 01/08/2015 at 18:46

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I'm in 6th gear doing 40.

bob and john > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:46

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you know ford already got into shit for over rating some of their cars (IIRC, it was a lincoln?).

wouldnt surprise me here either.

Manuél Ferrari > CRider 01/08/2015 at 18:47

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That seems wrong. Murican gallons should be bigger than EU gallons. We need to fix this by making our gallons twice the size they are now.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > I own dead car brands only 01/08/2015 at 18:47

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Was that average??

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > norskracer98-ExploringTheOutback 01/08/2015 at 18:47

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But then every car would fail....

Rico > RallyWrench 01/08/2015 at 18:47

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Came here for this.

Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:48

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we must kill all ze turbos!

down with the snails!

N/A 4 LYFE!

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Funktheduck 01/08/2015 at 18:48

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My old Astra did better and exceeded the EPA, with some hard acceleration every now and then. It was N/A though...

norskracer98-ExploringTheOutback > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:51

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Unfortunately, so as long as they keep up the BS they're doing we're fine. They could also not be so damn ridiculous with their regulations. Maybe US manufacturers could also start selling diesel cars getting good EmPeeGees getting to that damn CAFE number.

/ramblings.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 01/08/2015 at 18:51

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Ummm, no.

Funktheduck > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:51

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I would consistently beat EPA in all my vehicles that I actually paid attention to mpg. The 3 is pretty dialed in with the EPA apparently. Just under 12K miles so far and it averages 35.5 according to the computer. I do a lot of highway driving though.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > bob and john 01/08/2015 at 18:51

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I think they did for all of them honestly.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > NotUnlessRoundIsFunny 01/08/2015 at 18:52

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That! That's exactly it. It's got the "Boost", but where's the "Eco"?

RallyWrench > Zipppy, Mazdurp builder, Probeski owner and former ricerboy 01/08/2015 at 18:52

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Higher compression ratio + higher energy density fuel = less fuel required for ignition.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > norskracer98-ExploringTheOutback 01/08/2015 at 18:53

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WE NEED DIESELS HERE DAMMIT, BRING THE STD!!

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:54

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WUT!?! I thought you were anti-turbo!?!?

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > Zipppy, Mazdurp builder, Probeski owner and former ricerboy 01/08/2015 at 18:54

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DIESEL MAGIC

Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:56

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Pretty cars BUT:

first one was made for speed, not eco friendliness

second one is the original N/A version of the car (that sounds amazing!)

i respect the GT2RS cause it's bonkers. but i don't want one at all. much rather have GT3 RS

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:56

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A lot of people with the FordBoost F-150's average in the mid to low teens, so they aren't economical at all. Ecodiesel on the other hand...

norskracer98-ExploringTheOutback > bob and john 01/08/2015 at 18:56

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I know the F-150's are definitely over rated. I've read in normal truck driving conditions they do about the same a 6.2 SBC.

KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:57

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I can get above city MPG rating on my 1.6L Turbo Mini. I'm generally around combined rating.

And I have beaten highway MPG. By 3MPG.

http://www.fuelly.com/car/mini/coope…

So perhaps it's just Ford.

norskracer98-ExploringTheOutback > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:57

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Cruze RS diesel. Good idea, or really good idea?

RallyWrench > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 18:59

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Hmm, then I have nothing except aggressive tuning to keep the highly tuned engine alive. Also, I wouldn't run 87 in it. Less knock resistance=less timing advance=less economy & power.

RallyWrench > Funktheduck 01/08/2015 at 19:07

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The floor fell off for a very good reason: it was a piece of diamond plate held on with wood screws.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 01/08/2015 at 19:07

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People can have a change of heart, and learn some things, and become a bit more informed about some things. It just takes time.

I'm not all for it in every single application, but it has it's place.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 01/08/2015 at 19:08

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That would be nice. I still don't understand why we don't get diesels here..

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > KusabiSensei - Captain of the Toronto Maple Leafs 01/08/2015 at 19:09

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Could be.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > norskracer98-ExploringTheOutback 01/08/2015 at 19:09

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Good idea.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > RallyWrench 01/08/2015 at 19:10

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I couldn't even get EPA averages with 93, I see no point. The engine ECU will detune to use 87, so not like anything will go wrong.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 01/08/2015 at 19:11

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You still said death to turbos. They have their place, just not in every single road going machine. They can stay, just not be put in everything for the sake of "economy".

Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:12

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you are maturing faster than me!

pitstop_pitowski > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:12

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It all depends on how you drive, I have the same car and drive 75% city commute to work. Stop and go, etc. in KC. It's gotten worse since I warm up the car and the better figures are thanks to highway trips. Best I ever got was 42.7 mpg on a tank.

Sir_Stig: and toxic masculinity ruins the party again. > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:15

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You would be surprised.

bob and john > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:15

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you CAN get to the EPA for most car...sometimes a little over.

the only cars that I know of for sure the EPA COMPLETELY underrated were the TDI Audis.VW (at least the 2.0L) my dads A3 is rated for 36 HWY...LOL, we get 50+ HWY consistantly...

crowmolly > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:16

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Not my diesel VW. It beats EPA every fill up.

crowmolly > Leon711 01/08/2015 at 19:17

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US Gallon is 3.78L

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 01/08/2015 at 19:17

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I wouldn't say that.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > pitstop_pitowski 01/08/2015 at 19:18

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42.7???????

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Sir_Stig: and toxic masculinity ruins the party again. 01/08/2015 at 19:19

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Sounds like another 2 weeks or boring driving for me.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > bob and john 01/08/2015 at 19:21

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I mean, I didn't get a FoST for fuel economy, but it would still be nice to get those numbers at least ONCE?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > crowmolly 01/08/2015 at 19:22

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Because diesel.

AthomSfere > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:22

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Are you using an E blend? E blends get worse economy than regular all gas, gas...

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > AthomSfere 01/08/2015 at 19:22

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What's E blend?

Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:25

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yes you are

i'm still having trouble accepting ze modern turbos

I own dead car brands only > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:27

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average highway mpg, yeah. That also included several traffic jams.

consistent in 35k miles in one year.

pitstop_pitowski > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:27

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It was during the break-in period and I went on a country drive outside of town. Coasted down hills and didn't use the cruise but I drove "at a moderate pace" according to my notes. It should also be noted that I have only used 93 Octane (bless your eco-hating heart, BP).

Nibby > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:28

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Can confirm, there is a 2-3 mileage bump between 75-80 and 60-70 in the Sequoia... that is, with a 5.7L engine. I've gotten 19-20, (21 once I tried really hard) on the highway.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:29

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This kind of ruined the American view on diesels.

It was heinously unreliable and underpowered.

LeonardSkeonard, FiSTer > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:29

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1. It's winter. MPG drops quite a bit in the cold.

2. You said you drive 75-80 on the highway. The EPA tests at either 55 or 65 mph, I can't remember which. Fuel economy drops drastically as your speed increases over 55 mph. At 55 I get over 40 mpg in the FiST. At 75 I get 33-34 mpg.

http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2009/…

With that being said, I've averaged about 28 mpg during my 5 months of ownership. It's rated at 26-35. My worst tank to date is 16.8. My best tank is 40.5 mpg.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 01/08/2015 at 19:29

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They're not bad!

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:30

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Do you still hate the Boostang?

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Nibby 01/08/2015 at 19:30

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But it's also N/A, I'm not sure I believe that an FI car would do likewise.

Vicente Esteve > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:31

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"Pricey-Boost"

Nibby > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:32

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Doesn't matter if it is N/A or FI... the engine is still doing more work to keep a car going at 75mph than it is at 65.

Manuél Ferrari > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:32

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I know!

That's why I need to mature!

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 01/08/2015 at 19:33

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One car had the power to ruin diesels for America?? American diesels are better now!!

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > LeonardSkeonard, FiSTer 01/08/2015 at 19:35

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When I got 23 average, it was relatively warm and nice out. It wasn't freezing cold like it is now. It was always in the mid-high 40s.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 01/08/2015 at 19:37

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It's not for me. It has it's place but it's not for me, and it's not a modern SVO dammit. I'd take a V6 or GT over the EB, but if the EB allows more GTs to be made and for longer, than so be it.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Vicente Esteve 01/08/2015 at 19:38

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Sounds about correct.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:39

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More or less, yes. It was noisy, low on power, and few made it past 50k miles. That ruined it for diesel powered cars at least. Of course VW and MB made quite a few, but those are exceptions.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Manuél Ferrari 01/08/2015 at 19:39

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Fucking do it!! DO IT NOW!!

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 01/08/2015 at 19:41

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Doesn't Ford have some Diesels in Europe that are the same as our cars here?

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > Nibby 01/08/2015 at 19:41

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oooh you have a Sequoia. It is as comfy as it looks? I had the 5.7L in a work Tundra I had for a year and it was an awesome engine.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Nibby 01/08/2015 at 19:42

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I simply refuse to go slower than traffic. It's bad enough people do 60 in the fast lane here.

Sir_Stig: and toxic masculinity ruins the party again. > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:42

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If you keep it low enough RPMs that the turbo isn't spooled it's an even bigger difference.

Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:43

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Oh yeah, the Focus, Fiesta, Mondeo, etc. all have available diesels.

Nibby > Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo 01/08/2015 at 19:43

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It's very comfortable... great for road trips.

Nibby > K-Roll-PorscheTamer 01/08/2015 at 19:44

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k

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Sir_Stig: and toxic masculinity ruins the party again. 01/08/2015 at 19:44

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It fully spools at 1800rpm under load, so....

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Nibby 01/08/2015 at 19:45

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Just saying.

K-Roll-PorscheTamer > Jordan and the Slowrunner, Boomer Intensifies 01/08/2015 at 19:46

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Why not bring them here??